Take the Elevator
This podcast is purely about elevating people through individual life stories and experiences in the Elevator. In the Elevator, what's key is maybe changing your perspective; having self-actualization; embracing your purpose; and acting on it as we grow from one another. There is a whole different point of view when you look up to elevate.
Take the Elevator
382nd Floor: Elevate with Karla, Founder of Empathy for Autism Calfiornia
Author, speaker, and founder Karla Chinen, a Latina powerhouse, invites us into a life shaped by resilience: parenting two autistic kids, discovering her own late diagnosis, and building Empathy for Autism California so families aren’t reduced to numbers or left out by language and culture.
We talk about the moments that matter: a mother demanding a same-day diagnostic letter so early intervention could start within weeks; how autistic girls often mask and get overlooked; and why empathy isn’t a personality trait, it’s a teachable skill. Karla breaks down practical systems—sensory-informed outings, meltdown playbooks, and one-on-one time for siblings—that protect joy and strengthen marriages under stress. She’s frank about leaving a slow, political 9–5 to create a mission-led nonprofit with bilingual resources, sensory-friendly events, and trainings that rehumanize organizational practice.
You’ll hear a blueprint for action: push for timely evaluations, ask for services you’re eligible for, and partner with professionals who learn your child’s name before their case number. We also spotlight Karla’s podcast, Voices Beyond the Spectrum, where families and experts share travel tips, education advocacy, and underused supports many don’t know to request.
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Look up, and let's elevate!
It's gender builders.
SPEAKER_00:And of course.
SPEAKER_01:And welcome everyone to Take the Elevator.
SPEAKER_00:Yes, welcome.
SPEAKER_01:It has been quite a morning. It's one of those mornings where everything could go wrong. It did as far as the recording of this, but we're back.
SPEAKER_00:It's perspective.
SPEAKER_01:We're doing persistence and resilience and just saying we're going to do this.
SPEAKER_00:No, it's just perspective. It's how you look at life. You know, sometimes you look at life as you're winning, and then sometimes you're looking at I gotta catch up to win some more.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, I got catching up to win. Okay, let's catch up.
SPEAKER_00:So this weekend, we we ventured into something that we haven't done in quite a while. And before I go into that completely, I just want you guys to know if you hear a little background laughter and some little chatter here and there, we have a special guest, an amazing guest, and I can't wait to announce it. But we've got to talk about this real quick. We ventured into something we haven't done in quite a while, right? And that thing is singing together and playing music together. For those of you that don't know, of course, I'm a musician. I talk about that all the time. But Jen is a musician as well. She plays the piano very well and has trained for many years, but she has put that aside for a while.
SPEAKER_01:And speaking of uh coming back and winning, yes, yes. I for years I didn't think we were ever gonna sing together again. Corey does beautiful harmony. We've always done it as part of who we are. And uh long story short, I had a surgery that really changed my voice, and I didn't like the register I was in. So um I thought for sure it's done, right? Um, but it's come back. And I not just that it's come back, but the joy and the fulfillment that I get from sitting behind the keyboard and getting this thing with you again has been everything and uh something new for us. We're starting to write music together.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_01:So more to come from Jenco on that.
SPEAKER_00:Indeed. But today, guys, I want you to sit back, relax, put your seatbelt on, because we're gonna go for a wild ride. We have a special guest, and um this is actually take two. So I get an opportunity to really drive this announcement and hype her in so she can come in the way she deserves to be announced. So this is a woman who is an author. She's a podcast host, she's a founder, and the founding business uh that she uh is operating and director, and the one that she's operating is called Autism Sympathy for Autism. Um she's a coordinator and an author, uh a speaker, a public speaker, and she's just so incredible. I've I've done some research on her, I've looked her up, I've heard some videos, I've heard some wild stories, and maybe we can get into that a little bit later. But let's welcome into the elevator, Miss Carla Chinnan.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you. Hi, hi, thank you very much, both of you. Um thank you again for for welcoming me to your podcast.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely. So, Carla, give us a little bit of an introduction for you, for yourself, and uh tell tell the audience what you want them to know out the gate.
SPEAKER_02:Um I think if anything, I am resilient. I think. Um obviously I I've had my challenges through my path with my children, my personal experience, but I think the biggest thing is empathy came out of the the organization Empathy for Autism California came out of um a need that I found within our community. And you know, I'm blessed to be here, I'm blessed to be able to provide the knowledge I have to other families as well as even to professionals, and to be able to help the community more than anyone else.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So that's that's what I want to do.
SPEAKER_01:Love it. And behind every good organization, there is a good story, and that I know really speaks to people is why would she do this? What there's gotta be something in this from her and for her and her family that exists. So can you give us the spark that started all of this? Definitely.
SPEAKER_02:Um it's it starts from my childhood, and as we go on with this podcast, we'll go into more detail of that. Um, but um growing up as an immigrant in in this country and my mother not knowing the language, and my brother actually is also autistic and having more substantial needs. I I had to take that additional um parent role with my brother and be the translator and the interpreter for my mother. So I saw where the need was necessary for our Hispanic community, where they're not getting the resources and they're having to have their little six, seven-year-old child outcome and translate documentation for them. So I I saw the need there with with my Hispanic community and Latino community. And then um, from there we can go ahead and go into more detail about other stuff that has happened with the organization and my children and my own personal journey.
SPEAKER_01:Absolutely. So, empathy, I I love to talk about that word a little bit because this is what you've named your organization. There's so many amazing words, and we believe in the power of words and the intention and picking it. So, talk to us about empathy for autism, California. What about that word really speaks to you?
SPEAKER_02:Um, that's actually a question that comes up a lot. Um, I think it's I guess a unique way to spin that word in an organization title. Um, for me, it's genuine. It's I think empathy, a lot of people assume people are born with it, and that's not the case. I think empathy is a skill that has to be developed and can be developed. And that's what my organization is about. Not only developing that skill within our own community with our parents, but also developing that bridging that gap between professionals and families to be able to bring in that empathy also into the corporate and the organizational world that sometimes gets a little bit dehumanized with calling a client by a number or calling them clients, period, instead of family, instead of humans. So I think it's bringing that level of empathy and understanding, you know, into organizations as well.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I I really appreciate you um emphasizing that. Uh, the client or the number. How about a name? You know, a lot of times we just forget to call people by the preferred name that they've been given by their own mothers. And so that that plays a big part. I was looking up the word empathy, and you're right, it is a uh skill set that has to be developed because it says the ability, and to have an ability, you have to acquire that. And it says the ability to understand, share the feelings of another. And so um in your in your business of empathy for autism, how has it affected your your family? And and can you introduce some of the things that you've learned since um your family dynamic? And I want you to be able to announce that. I don't want to tell that story.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, of course. Um, well, uh obviously my passion is with autism. I have two autistic children, Ada and 12. He has a more substantial uh support needs, and then Sophia, she is um 10, and her support needs are not as um expensive, and she's also gifted on top of that, which adds another layer when it came to getting her diagnosis. Uh, because sometimes professionals assume that an individual is not competent with the autism diagnosis, and it's not the case. A lot of autistic individuals are extremely competent. I myself am autistic, you know, I got a like diagnosis, and it was out of um, I I went to the doctor to get uh an anxiety diagnosis because I, you know, I need I wanted to take a medication to kind of help me cope with some of the emotions I was feeling. And I came out of there with an awesome diagnosis. But then after that diagnosis kicks in, I see my daughter, and I'm she's a carbon copy of what I used to be as a kid. It's just my situation's very different to hers growing up, having to be that I had to be that glass child. And I speak about that in my book, you know, um, that I wrote of the the different roles that an individual has to step into when a diagnosis impacts the family household. So that's that's that's the big reason behind this whole autism and empathy-driven um organization and cost for the community.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So can you tell us a little bit more about when Adrian and Sophia were diagnosed and what that experience was like because we really want to bring up the understanding, and and I think part of that understanding comes from hearing about experiences.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, definitely. Um, well, I had Sophia uh September, I mean I'm sorry, July 13. So five days later, I have my son's um autism diagnosis appointment. And with that being said, uh my I had to have my mom take care of my daughter because she couldn't go into the hospital yet due to the lack of vaccines at that time. So then we my husband and I, we either go take Adrian to get evaluated. I had already heard of this doctor taking a year to give that diagnosis letter. And I was not about to wait a year for early intervention for my son. So what I had done prior to that is I scheduled all of her team specialists, occupational therapy, speech, physical therapy, all the specialists you can imagine, they all pointed to autism. So when I stepped into her office, she asked, Um, well, why are your concerns? I'm like, here are the lists of behaviors I see that are not um, or not behaviors, just signs that I see of things that are a little bit off with how a typical kid that is 21 months old should be behaving or should be doing in skill sets. So, with that being said, here's my list. Here's also all the reports from all the specialists you're gonna send me to stating that it's autism. I love this. Yes. And then she looks at me, she's like, Are you a doctor or a teacher? And I'm like, No, I'm a concerned parent. And I've done my set of research with you, and I need that letter today. I'm not gonna wait. So when I leave here, I want that letter with his diagnosis so I can move forward with the next steps that I need to to get him the therapies he needs to. And she's like, Okay, well, let's go over the reports, and that's I think where the mom kicks in instead of the advocate. You know, I'm sitting there listening to all the things that uh are highlighted to show the where where my de my son is deficit at. And already she's setting expectations for him ten years from now in that room of what he's not going to be able to do.
SPEAKER_01:So she's not only confirming the diagnosis, but now listing the the things he won't be able to do, the things he won't be able to experience as a normal child. And and you're receiving this news for the first time as mom.
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So yeah, so yeah, I I'm sitting there and I and he's comparing to typic uh atypical child's, you know, growth spurs and and and and and you know, at that point I'm just processing things. And then she goes and says, Oh, and if you plan on having more kids, just you know, keep in mind that autism is there's a probability that it is genetic. And I'm thinking to myself, whoa, my five-day old daughter is at home. So I guess I'll have to keep an eye on her. And then with her, the diagnosis is different, and most of the time it is with all girls, because women and and girls, we are raised culturally to abide by different standards than a male or a boy. So therefore, we become really good at masking, masking what I we feel, what we do, making sure we control the stems and things like that. So it was it with her, it was a a lot longer journey to get that diagnosis, but we got it. Okay. And then with me, it's even a longer journey.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, because your diagnosis was when.
SPEAKER_02:This year, actually. Yeah. Yeah. As I finally had time for myself a little bit, so I was able to tackle things and uh go to that doctor's appointment that pointed out to my diagnosis.
SPEAKER_00:Now, as as I said in the beginning of this podcast, you know, a lot of times when you when you hear these kind of conversations, you you pull out the tissue box, you're prepared to be sad, you're prepared to um take on this this adventurous story that's gonna be pulling on the heartstrings. And and some of it is, I'm not gonna lie and say it's all roses, but this is a very resilient woman. And she self-professed in the very beginning of this uh podcast. And so, as I told you, she's an author, she's a public speaker, um, she has her own business, she's raising two children. She's also a wife. And so we need to get into that. And this is just good stuff because Jen and I love good wholesome family stories with you know the peaks and the valleys. So give us a little bit of background on your relationship as far as uh mom, wife, business owner, speaker.
SPEAKER_01:It's all the roles that yeah, all the roles that's happening for you.
SPEAKER_02:Definitely. Um, I've been blessed to have found, you know, what I call a soulmate. I know it might sound a little cheesy. Like it. Um my husband, he he's honestly my best friend and supporter. Like, I remember every time I have some idea or like, oh, I'm gonna write a book, and he's like, go for a cigar. And then I'm like, babe, because I'm I'm actually also right now currently in the process of acquiring my master's degree. So uh I told my husband, I'm like, I can take a break from school if you want to go do sweetheart. I live by cursely through you. Don't worry, you do your thing, you know? And um I I couldn't have had a better husband. He he's an amazing supporter, he's an amazing father to my kids. Um, have we had our challenges and is our marriage perfect? No. Um, especially when the honestly said diagnosis kicks kicked into our household. It was a lot of adjusting, it was a lot of um back and forth in parenting and different different perspectives we had in parenting. I was the one that was in charge of all the therapies, so I got all the additional trainings that he didn't. So I had to learn how to convey that training to him without sounding so condescending or so directive to him, so that way he could be willing to learn. Because I knew if he learned as a parent with children that have a diagnosis, especially those children that you know you're gonna be supporting them for the rest of their life, uh it comes a l it comes with a lot of baggage of anxiety, not knowing what's gonna happen to them when we're no longer here. So I knew I carried a lot of that anxiety, knowing that my son was the only, I was the only individual my son could really communicate with and express his needs. And if my husband didn't jump on that wagon with me and I got him to understand that, um, it wasn't gonna be good for my son, for me, or for anyone in the household. So it took him being a better man to for him to be able to process those feelings.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah. And um, if if you could just venture into how you decided to podcast and write a book.
SPEAKER_02:Well, honestly, the organization, the time I I started um the organ organization in March. I think by April I was already doing podcasting. Okay. That was this year.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So so it just wow, that's a lot this year, Carla. Wow, okay.
SPEAKER_00:So you you took no time off to to pity yourself and say, oh, woe is me. I'm just gonna go home and relax and you jumped right into a podcast.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, she had to move, like there's a lot of movement there.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And Carla, I love what you shared with Corey and I before, where you said when you used to work, like your eight to five, nine to five, and what they diagnosed you with. And I'd love to hear more about that transition and what you're experiencing now as a business owner.
SPEAKER_02:Um prior to the diagnosis, honestly, I always thought there was something wrong with me, or I was weird of the way I behaved in certain ways, because to me, I'm very logical. Like you go to a you go to a business meeting and you sit there and they're all talking about things that are gonna happen, like these great goals and ambitions of uh progress in the organization. But then in reality, after that meeting, sometimes only like 10% of what was spoken in that meeting actually happens and it's put into action, you know, and it's it's it's very frustrating for an autistic person to process that because here you are investing your time into that meeting, creating these presentations to make sure that everyone's on board with it. But then the reality is that's how society works in the typical world, you know, and it's sometimes just not to say that those organizations I work for didn't do and are not doing amazing things with families, but the speed that they do it on because of politics is different, you know. I'm I'm I'm blessed to not have um oversight in that regard as far as how getting a logo approved or getting colors approved, you know, it can be very frustrating. Oh god. So so with that being said, I always thought I was there was something wrong. I would always, like I said, be called they would say, Oh, you're too much. Relax. You don't need to do that, or you're an overachiever, you need to relax. And that was my nickname, overachiever at at certain organizations. And and so that was happening in the organization, and I would always have these like talks at night with my husband. I'm like, is there something wrong with me? Like, are my expectations such that are unobtainable to people? Or because I'm if I'm hard on people, I'm you don't even know the kind of pressure I put on myself as an individual to be. So then the diagnosis kicks in and I'm like, oh, it all makes sense now. You know, like I understand now why I had such difficulty, and especially sometimes building that relationship with um same gender, like what I've always had more male friends than female friends, and I never understood why. Um I like football, I like um physical activity, like I growing up, and I'm crazy, like I skydived and things like that. So I didn't understand how a lot of females don't like those kind of things, and also a lot of the times I felt judged when I was around a lot of females compared to males. Males, whatever I said, it was it was black and white conversations with them. With females, there's so much gray in between and emotionalness that I it was so hard for me to handle. You know, and now in the community that I've I'm building with our families, we have our children in uh best well-being and our experiences as mothers of neurodivergent children that makes it a little bit easier for me to now connect and engage. And they're they're amazing women, you know. But initially, in the beginning of all this, even growing up, I struggled in that department significantly. And I never knew why. I thought there was just I was just weird. Yeah. And I just categorized myself as weird. But now I'm learning to love myself and not have to feel the need of masking and doing things like that.
SPEAKER_01:Wow, what a freeing and empowering experience it sounds like it's been for you. Um what really sticks out to me too, guys, is that that lack of education, lack of knowledge really is such a huge gap in our lives. But once we seek to help or we get something concrete, like you said, it's like oh, it makes sense and then it helps with the trajectory of moving forward, right? Which means you're doing what you did for your son. And you're like, I need this diagnosis because we need intervention as early as possible because that helps, doesn't it? Um getting the interventions timely like that, Carla, what what give us an idea what the difference is with timely and the right interventions versus something that happens later or maybe not at all.
SPEAKER_02:Um, for example, with my son, I got that uh diagnosis that same day. I don't literally, it was a month later, he was already having ADA therapy and and speech therapy and occupational therapy. So we started working on things within a month of that diagnosis with him. Um, as opposed to sometimes a lot of what happens with a lot of our families culturally, sometimes they're in denial of the diagnosis and wait a little bit longer. What happens when you wait a little bit longer, sometimes with children, not all the time, but sometimes with certain children, is they start falling behind on other areas of their life as well as academically. And then it takes a lot longer for them to catch up once systems are placed. So, because of that early intervention, I was able to reach out to Adrian's regional center that he is part of, and from there get additional resources. Also, once you become, let's say, a regional center client, if the individual is eligible for it due to diagnosis and due to needs, then at that point you could also access other resources, like for example, Respid, where um it's a caregiver that comes and takes care of the child for a few hours a day. So I can have that one-on-one time for my husband or my daughter. Because a lot of the times when we go to outings with my daughter, my son, and my husband, it's very everything's modified. It's everything so Adrian doesn't have a meltdown, so his sensory is where it needs to be. So I feel sometimes I don't want to take away from experiences from my daughter. So we've also now started incorporating one weekend a month where we spent just a weekend with her. Like obviously, maybe not the whole weekend, but a day taking her to a preferred place of hers where she doesn't have to eat pizza. She can eat dumplings if she wants to, you know, things like that.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah. So ironically, I combed through your uh Instagram and I've heard a couple of the stories. Um, when you said meltdown, uh, most people don't know what that would entail. And I'm not gonna ask you to tell any of the stories that I listened to because I don't know if you want to or not. However, what I did learn is that you and your husband have learned how to act very quickly and resolve things in a very timely manner. So I I again I commend this this education that you bring. But my question is because people don't know how high functioning you are, how high functioning your daughter is, um, they may approach you with a condescending way of uh talking to you. How do you cope with that and how do you educate people on how to address you properly?
SPEAKER_02:Um, I've I've experienced that sometimes um when I posted about I haven't posted anything per se about my diagnosis, but people attended a presentation that I did where I disclosed my diagnosis. Not that I'm ashamed of it, I just haven't had literally time to post anything as of lately in regards to a personal matter. But um I started seeing um certain comments or not comments, but certain penniness, I would call it, where they say, oh, um, autism is not a trend, you know, or and I'm thinking to myself, like, oh, like I don't just I mean, uh for me, I'm not one that loves to I don't like victimizing myself. I'm not sitting there telling people my struggles. I mean, I I go through things with the autism, you know. I after I have a big event, I come home and I just want to be by myself wrapped up in like a burrito in my bed in the dark because I'm so over-censored. You know, but I feel that's that's very private. So why should I have to justify my diagnosis? So when I have these talks, that's where my husband comes in. You know, he tells me, and he uh he's he's honestly the person that has taught me this. You cannot control what other people do or say, you can only control how it makes you feel as an individual. So don't give them that power. You know what you are, you know what you're doing, and just run with that. You know, don't don't let those people in and disturb your peace because then they've won. So that's that's that's very uh he he's he he grounds me significantly nice when he when I have those talks with him. And then with my daughter, I've always told her she doesn't have to be ashamed of her diagnosis. She's um she's she's a very amazing human, you know, and very rational for her age. It's it sometimes trips me out. Um, but uh I I I lead by example with her. So I I I carry myself a certain way so she learns how to carry herself a certain way and not be ashamed.
unknown:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:You're such a wonderful role model, you and your husband, to your kiddos. And I can only imagine who they are today and who they're going to be as a result. Um you are so right, Carla, in introducing yourself as resilient. I think that is if I had a takeaway word for you today during this episode, it would be that resilience, tenacity, driven. Um, and I love how you recognize your whole self. And there's just such amazing awareness in you. Um so that would be another episode. But because we're coming down to time, I really want to give you an opportunity to talk about um just a couple of things here. What's the future for your organization? Where can people connect with you and tap into what you're doing? And if they have any questions, what does that look like?
SPEAKER_02:Definitely. Um, thank you very much. So, with the organization where I see it going, um, as of right now, I've been blessed to be um uh um welcomed or I'm joining a few conference conferences. So where we met, we did the 39th annual uh conference, uh children's conference of San Bernardino in February. We're gonna I'm gonna have another presentation out there for early start and head start department, which I'm hoping that you know um I'm able to connect with a lot of professionals and parents in regards to how we can bridge that gap between parents and professionals. Um, and then as As far as a whole, we're we've been growing significantly with the organization, doing events. We're gonna have one in December 7th at the Winery Center Megula where we're gonna have a sensitive Santa come out with Mrs. Claus, take pictures with our kiddos, our neurodivergent children and this and children with disabilities and their families. And we're gonna have a cool petting suit, a lot of cool event cool things that are gonna happen for our families there. But um, in general, I just see the organization growing to it in a range where it can educate more individuals so they don't have to go through the stuff that sometimes us as parents, when we didn't have the education, had to go through. And it's not just the English-speaking politician, but also the Spanish-speaking population. Um, that that that that's our main focal or the underserved communities. Um, our main focus for our organization. How you can reach us, you can just go to our website. It's www.empathy for autismcalifornia.com. And there's a um uh you can just schedule an appointment. We just actually opened our first office in Marietta, uh, where I do appointments by uh, I mean, meetings by appointment. There you go. Meetings by appointment, and and then I also already set up um where organizations can book to do trainings for their organization. I also already started that portion with the in the website as well for the nonprofit. And then just continuing to get a lot of support. I've met amazing individuals, you know, um, through this organization, from the winery owners at Shape and Family to um Santa Bob, which is what he calls himself, which is an amazing individual. You know, so I'm just I just feel completely blessed to be in this situation to not only work doing what I'm passionate about, but just what we get from helping families, you know, in a selfish way, all the good feelings that you get from helping families and making sure that they that that sibling doesn't go unseen, that that husband and or that marriage lives through the um diagnosis.
SPEAKER_00:Love it.
SPEAKER_02:That the mother is self-regulated, you know?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, powerful, such good stuff. Um, I don't know that I'm gonna do it over this recording of the podcast, but there was something that I got goosebumps over, Carla, with Corey and I as children's book writers. Um, I'd love to talk about maybe an idea for collaboration. And I'm putting this here because I'm looking at you right now. Like please remind me because my list of things to do is quite long too. But um Corey, before we end it, anything that's coming during this uh 30-minute session with Carla.
SPEAKER_00:What's coming to me most is that you know, anytime you have any diagnosis, um don't just hang up the towel, don't just walk away with your head hung down. There's always hope. There's always another day coming. Um get the help that you need, get the proper diagnosis. Never rely on yourself to self-diagnose and look for these wonderful, amazing stories such as Carla's and and her children, um Sophia and Adrian. And and if you go on to the uh Instagram, you will see just how amazing these two children are. So that that's my takeaway, and I thank you from the bottom of my heart for sharing your story and your experiences. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you, thank you. Thank you for inviting me. And yeah, and you know, that's that's basically what what I want to do, just highlight our families. That's what I do through all also my podcast, highlighting families and sharing their stories. Yeah, what's your part of information?
SPEAKER_01:Let's plug that in.
SPEAKER_02:Um, it is vision um voices beyond the spectrum.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:So families come in and tell their stories from the diagnosis to where they're at now and share their different journeys depending on the topic at hand. So we've had uh how to travel with kiddos on the spectrum, or a mom that comes and talks about her journey with her son educationally through with his son having died uh being diagnosed with Down syndrome. So just different, different perspectives on parenting, different perspectives on caregiving, different perspectives on what they're going through in their journey. And then we also have a resource hub that's uh actually launching this month. And it's I'm bringing in now organizations as a separate addition to that same podcast for resources for our families. So people that don't know certain organizations out there to help them for something, they'll find out through that podcast.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And this is just growth this year. Um, I'm sure if we were to have you back here next year, we'd be blown away, Kyla, blown away at the way you're moving and how you're moving so intentionally with the backing and support of your husband. We want to say that that's so important. And that uh it's just so heartwarming to hear that he's on this journey with you and the type of support you all provide each other. Um so thank you again for gracing Take the Elevator with your stories, who you are as a business owner. And I think we can even tap into you in in some um advice in starting your own business and what that looks like. Um but that's for another episode. Much appreciated. No, thank you. Thank you both. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Well, you know it's to take the elevator. We say look up and let's elevate every day.
